David Mau Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 It seems that there is some confusion as to whether FGMCs are classified as an A-body or a G-body. Sometimes in articles they are referred to as G-bodies, or said to be based on the Pontiac Grand Prix. But the fact is - the '69-'72 Pontiac Grand Prix had a different frame than the FGMCs that used a 118" wheelbase instead of the Monte Carlo's 116" spread. I checked my 1970 Fisher Body Service Manual last night, and it listed the Monte Carlo model in the A-body column as "Chevelle - Monte Carlo". The only model listed as a G-body in 1970 was the Pontiac Grand Prix. I also checked to see what my Chevrolet Book of Numbers said - and it, too, listed the Monte Carlo as an A-body. Chevrolet included the Monte in its A-body mid-size listings by coding it in the 13000 series. Most parts suppliers also consider the FGMCs to be A-bodies. So, while the Monte Carlo's design and concept (a 2-door personal coupe) was the same as that of the '69 Grand Prix, it appears that the Grand Prix was a G-body while the Monte Carlo was still considered an A-body, like the other GM mid-size cars of the era. Does anyone else have any information regarding this "Is it an A-body or a G-body" terminology issue? Thanks, Dave ------------------ I'm Just Enjoyin' That Great S-S-Sensation; Diggin' My First G-G-Generation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 Interesting point indeed, makes me wonder what possible parts we could attain from the GM G-body Pontiac Grand Prix, for the restoration of our GM A-body Chevrolet Monte Carlo's. ------------------ <IMG SRC=\"http://home.attb...quot;> LLOYD@firstgenmc.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Hansen Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 Definately an A-body. Simularities are easily seen across the A body line up The 69-72 Grand Prix is a completely different car. And bigger & Heavier. A-body Monte Carlo, Cutlass, Skylark, Chevelle, Lemans/GTO or off into Canada, the Beauville <spelling>. As far as those articles go, most magazine & paper articles have inaccuracies thoughout. ------------------ 1944 GPW Army Jeep 1964 Buick Riviera- Still For Sale 1970 Monte Carlo Who Broke That Turbo 400? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
montefrazer Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 I know that when I was making frames for 73-77 Montes and other GM intermediates, they were called A frames. The new down sized 78-88 Monte, Chevelle, Lemans, etc. frame was called a G frame. Full sized were always called B frames. ------------------ Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 When looking for suspenssion parts for my car, i always look for "A-body" cars, like the Chevelle. I say and have always known them as A-body cars. Jon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 When they say "A-body" I always thought that referred to the body shell and not the frame. As we know, the body of a Monte is basically the same as the Chevelle and other A-bodies. Many A-bodies even share the same trunk lid. Also, I took a good look at a Grand Prix last year and it has the same roof line and back window as our Montes and other A-bodies. I'm still confused as to what the "A-body" refers to. ------------------ Aaron 1970 Misty Turquoise Monte Carlo My Monte Carlo Web Site Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
montefrazer Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 Frame size matched body size. B body cars used B frames, A body cars used A frames, etc. Putting a 70 Monte body on a 70 Impala frame would look a bit.... um... odd. I dug out my Hollander and the rear glass from a 69-70 Grand Prix interchanges with 70-72 Monte, but the roof doesn't. Something is different. Maybe longer due to the wheel base difference? 71-72 Grand Prix rear glass in different. Grand Prix listed a rear defogger in the glass. An up grade over the Monte blower. Something to keep in mind for a modification. I will go through the Hollander interchanges between GP and Monte to see if anything else fits. Will post results soon. ------------------ Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Reuter Posted March 20, 2003 Share Posted March 20, 2003 The Chevrolet SS Red Book refers to the 1st Gen Montes as G-bodies & I've read in Car Craft that it's an A/G body. Personally, I call it a G-body that shares parts with the A-body, especially the Chevelle. Also, cars can share the same basic architecture/frame and still have different widths & wheelbases. Look at all the cars Ford based on the Fox platform in the 80's as an example. ------------------ 01 Mustang Bullitt 99 Tahoe Z56 94 Caprice 9C1 85 Mustang GT 80 F250 70 Monte Carlo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
montefrazer Posted March 20, 2003 Share Posted March 20, 2003 Also, cars can share the same basic architecture/frame and still have different widths & wheelbases. Look at all the cars Ford based on the Fox platform in the 80's as an example. Now we get into frame, subframe, and unibody differences. Fox platforms were unibody not frames. All you do is weld your suspension points and braces to different floor pans and you have a different Fox platform. This system is used today to make most cars. Subframes were the Camaro/Nova system. One partial front frame bolted to various rear platforms. Our Montes with full frames don't easily change wheel base or width. A different frame is required for this. Yes, some parts are the same from one wheel base to another. We just use a longer rail between the front and rear sections. But, as the frame gets longer or wider, you need to go to heavier steel or more cross bracing. A full frame is more heavy duty than the other systems. This is why most trucks use full frames. If a Fox body Mustang is severely rusted, you need a lot of specialized equipment and skill to rebuild it. If a Monte is severely rusted you can unbolt the body and replace it. ------------------ Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Mau Posted March 21, 2003 Author Share Posted March 21, 2003 Well, first off - thanks for all the response, guys! Certainly you all can see why there is confusion as to what the FGMC actually IS considered to be. Based on what all has been said so far, I think that I will still refer to it as an A-body, myself. Like I mentioned in my initial post regarding this - that's how it's listed in the 1970 Fisher Body Service Manual AND the Chevrolet Book of Numbers, while the Grand Prix was the only model listed as a G-Body back then. Mid-size GM A-body cars from 1968-72 used a "dual wheelbase" scenario, which typically meant a 112" for 2-doors and a 116" for 4-doors. The El Camino, GMC Sprint and Monte Carlo were the exceptions, however, also using a 116" wheelbase. And like Bob Hansen said, the Grand Prix was a bigger and heavier car. Not only did it have what I believe to be a unique 118" wheelbase, but I also think that its track was a little wider, to boot. It did, however, share some parts with the A-body cars, as has been pointed out. AARON - A-body cars were what GM called their range of mid-size cars back in the day, as they were all built from a lot of the same components. Like Steve "montefrazer" mentioned, B-bodies were the standard full-size cars such as the Impala. The even larger cars like the Cadillac DeVilles and others (the Olds Ninety-Eight, perhaps?) had another designation - C-body, I believe. The Nova was an X-body. F-bodies were the specialty compacts Camaro and Firebird. The Riviera and Toronado had their own designation, as well. Man, I guess I'll have to get out that Fisher Body Manual yet again! LOL Dave ------------------ I'm Just Enjoyin' That Great S-S-Sensation; Diggin' My First G-G-Generation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 26, 2003 Share Posted March 26, 2003 I believe our cars are a-bodies. They are built on the 4dr frames hence the longer wheelbase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kc8oye Posted March 29, 2003 Share Posted March 29, 2003 THey're all A-bodies I don't believe the G-body desgination was used until the late 70's early 80's when the simply changed the name from a-body to g-body so that they could use the a-body designation for the new FWD cars coming out.. ------------------ '72 monte w SBC 'nuff said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grease Posted March 30, 2003 Share Posted March 30, 2003 The First Gen Monte uses a special frame . yes its wheel base is 116 like the four door and elky, which dont use the same frame either. Monte Frame is long in the front section , firewall forward.side rails and rear are same as a 2 door chevelle Elky uses a station wagon frame which has a different shape out back , and long side rails chevelle 4 door uses a longer side rails than a 2 door , the rear section same as 2 door chevelle and Monte mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Mau Posted March 31, 2003 Author Share Posted March 31, 2003 That makes complete sense to me, Mike. Even though the Monte had a 116" wheelbase like that of the Chevelle 4-doors, wagons and El Camino - the frames themselves were configured a bit differently depending on the application. kc8oye - Yes, the G-Body designation became more common later on, but the Pontiac Grand Prix WAS considered a G-Body back in '70, as it was listed as such in the 1970 Fisher Body Service Manual. A 1970 Monte Carlo test article says that in creating the Monte Carlo from the Chevelle that Chevrolet "used the G-Body roof", so it wasn't just GM that used the G-Body designation back then. Thanks for the input, guys! Dave ------------------ I'm Just Enjoyin' That Great S-S-Sensation; Diggin' My First G-G-Generation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 the monte carlo carries a 116" wheelbase but the engine holds the same distance to the rear end, effectively giving a 4" engine setback due to the wheelbase increase being in front of the firewall-a fact that the dirttrack racer in my area ( south-western ontario )were well aware of and caused a lot of montes to be cut up because they handled better than the chevelles. bob hansen-the chevelle counterpart is the pontiac beaumont, similarly the nova counterpart was the acadian each of which had split type grills and interior appointments more similar to the GTO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Mau Posted April 1, 2003 Author Share Posted April 1, 2003 You're right, Sharky. When Chevrolet designed the first generation Monte Carlo, it was as if they took a 112" wheelbase 2-door Chevelle, pulled the front wheels forward 4", and then added an additional 4" of front overhang; all while keeping the engine in the same place. Monte Carlos are basically Chevelle 2-doors with an 8" longer hood. And better weight distribution. When Chevrolet designers were working on the first generation Camaro, they wanted to pull the front wheels a little more forward, too, but they weren't allowed to because they were locked into using the same front subframe as the Nova. Dave ------------------ I'm Just Enjoyin' That Great S-S-Sensation; Diggin' My First G-G-Generation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 Hey Hey I don't know if it's true but I heard that are Montes frame are the same as a Chevelle wagon wrong or right?? Dave ------------------ <A HREF="http://groups.msn.com/ChevyMonteCarlo/shoebox.msnw http://datadave49.tripod.com/ TARGET=_blank>http://groups.msn.com/ChevyMonteCarlo/shoebox.msnw http://datadave49.tripod.com/ </a> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grease Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 EHHHHHH WRONG . the wagon while having 116" wheelbase is a totally different frame then the Monte . mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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