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Camshaft choice


72 Monte Carlo

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I just bought a 70 Chevelle 402 350 HP 2 bolt main complete motor. It has cylinder heads # 3964290 - 69-70 oval port, closed chamber 101cc, and 10.25:1 compression pistons in it.

I'm wanting to put a new cam, lifters, valve springs, and roller tip rockers in it.

My 72 Monte Carlo currently has a 396 SBC Stroker motor with only cam break-in time and 1/4 of road trip on it. It has a turbo 350 trans, 28" tall rear tires, and a 12 bolt posi with 2.73 gears. I plan on getting either 3.31 or 3.55 gears for it later on.

I've got Hooker Competition ceramic 2" primaries long tube headers, an Edelbrock Performer 2-0 intake, and a Holley 3310 780 cfm carb for it.

I've been looking at the Lunati Voodoo 60201 and 60202 cams. The lunati tech said that I should go with the 60201 cam because of it being a heavy car, and the rpm of that cam is 1000 - 5500 rpm. 

I want it to be a good street driver with a slight lope at idle, but it needs to have some great torque too.

Does any fellow Monte owners have any sound bites of these cams, and real world experience with them?

The last big block 402 I had was in a 74 Chevy Cheyenne Super 4x4 lifted shortbox pickup, with 3.73 gears, 4" lift, and 35" tires. I had a Crane 272-H10 cam in it and it was a torque beast.

Any other camshafts that I should look at?

Thanks for any advice that you can provide.

Doug

 

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I ' ve seen a good cam for these BBC heavy cars .540" lift with a 218/224 Deg. Hydraulic Comp.cams would work great for your car.Lots of bottom end torque and good mid range 5500rpm (shift points).. I'd run a 2200-2400 stall converter, 3:55 rear gear ratio . The turbo 350 trans is a good choice, for the 1st gear launch. I'm going with this cam in a 427 with same heads. very nice lope it too!! I wanting to find a roller like this. I'm contacting Bullet racing cams about this in a roller. Lunati is a very good choice for cams , and if you do the ground work you will not loose a cam lobe. Attention is in the details!! ( i.e. ,Comp.Cams Beehive Springs,10 deg.locks, rollertip stamped rockers are a must on these BBC cylinder heads)...  post-259-0-61935100-1474727657_thumb.jpg   Also good pushrods. And don't forget Stellite exhaust inserts and stainless valves. Just my 2 cents........

Edited by 420ponies
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I think the 201 is too small for a muscle car. Might be good in a boat, or a motorhome.

I ran the 202 in my otherwise stock 454 and even with it's low compression I got decent vacuum, mileage, and a sound from the tailpipe that gave the impression something might be lurking under the hood. I had a comp xtreme 286 before the voodoo and i liked the voodoo better. A big block engine has enough torque that you will never notice any loss in low speed grunt with the larger cam vs the smaller one, but you very well might notice a difference at higher rpms.

Funny, I tried to look them up at Summit, and the part numbers are different, or have changed. Both the voodoo cams have good descriptions with them. I think with the higher compression you are running, the larger cam will be more pump gas friendly.

Summit numbers: Voodoo 10110701, and Voodoo 10110702. Both of these are hydraulic flat tappet cams.

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The Lunati Voodoo cams are as follows;

10110701

Int 256*/Exh 262*

@.050 Int 213/Exh 219

Gross lift Int .515/Exh .530

LSA/ICL 112/108

1000-5500 rpm range

 

10110702

Int 262*/Exh 268*

@.050 Int 219/Exh 227

Gross lift Int .530/Exh .542

LSA/ICL 112/108

1400-5800 rpm range

 

10110703

Int 268*/Exh 276*

@.050 Int 227/Exh 233

Gross lift Int .542/Exh .554

LSA/ICL 110/106

1800-6200 rpm range

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that's them.

Once you get into the 110 LSA cams, you loose vacuum and brakes can be an issue, Sadly, they also give that rotten idle that sounds good to the ear.

The bigger the engine, the more cam it will take. A 454 might be happy with the 703, but the 396/402 engine might find it a bit much for a daily driver.

It;s always better to error on the small side...that's probably why the cam guy recommended the 701,

No matter what cam you choose, it's bound to be better than the stock cam because of the added lift the aftermarket cams give. Stock cams are around 480 max lift I think...to go bigger you will need long slot rockers and matching springs, as the stock pieces won't handle larger lift.

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The Erson E119816 roller cam in my 350 installed by Quinlan Automotive in INDY on the tube it cam in has

510/510

218/226

112 degree

I do not under stand all of this but thought I'd share anyhow.

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camshaft selection is a tough decision. It determines the behavior of your engine like no other ad-on piece.

Mechanical and roller cams are hard to compare. Rollers get the job done with much less duration, so a roller cam with good specs ends up having a decent idle, while the mechanical (flat) cam ends up with a rough idle...doing the same job. 

and small block engines have different needs than big block engines. Comparing cam specs between the two only causes confusion.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Call Chris at Straub Technologies (straubtechnologies.com). He specializes in roller cams but will recommend and sell flat tappet cams as well. Be ready to answer a bunch of questions about your engine and car, but I promise he'll set you up and you won't be disappointed.

or Mike Lewis Racing Engines (lewisracingengines.com) is closer to you. He can do the same thing. Don't let the "racing engines" scare you, he won't recommend something you won't be happy with.

Both are very reasonable and good at what they do.

Trust the experts, not the hype. I'll never buy another catalog cam again. 

Scott

 

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  • 2 months later...

This past winter I rebuilt the 402 for my 72’.  I was just looking to freshen it up with a mild flat tappet cam, trying to save some money.  I’ve broken in many cams over the years, but this one went south in a hurry.  I lost one lobe on break in, I did use proper break in oil and procedures.  I didn’t want to spend the big money on a hydraulic roller, but I ended up having to and them some for a complete set of bearings and machine shop bill for cleaning it all back out. It’s a hard pill to swallow paying that extra, but I strongly suggest you consider a roller setup.   I went with a complete Lunati kit, #20110548 cam, 535”/.545” lift,  220/230 duration @ .050”.   Other than that it’s .030” over, 9.0:1 CR, stock 292 oval ports, Performer 2-O intake, Comp Cams roller tip rockers, Q jet for now.  I’ve only had it on the run stand so far. I don’t know if this is true,  but from what I’ve read and been told, the flat tappet cores are not up to the quality they use to be.  Here’s a short video with the roller cam.  

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  • 1 month later...

Lunati Tech chatted with me and he said that the Voodoo Retro-Fit Hydraulic Roller Cam - Chevrolet Big Block 282/290 20110712 on a LSA 112 would be a great cam for our heavy cars. - Retro-Fit Hydraulic Roller Cam. High performance street cam. Likes upgraded intake, carb and exhaust. Needs 2800 RPM stall converter in most cases. Requires 9.5:1 compression for maximum performance.; Advertised Duration (Int/Exh): 282/290; Duration @ .050 (Int/Exh): 231/239; Gross Valve Lift (Int/Exh): .600/.600; LSA/ICL: 110/106; Valve Lash (Int/Exh): Hyd/Hyd; RPM Range: 2200-5800

I do like the sound of Tim's car though - 20110548 Street/Strip Retro-Fit Hydraulic Roller Cam - Chevrolet Big Block 287/298 Retro-Fit Hydraulic Roller Cam. Good for high performance street and street rod use. Good mid range torque and HP. Fair idle.; Advertised Duration (Int/Exh): 287/298; Duration @ .050 (Int/Exh): 220/230; Gross Valve Lift (Int/Exh): .535/.545; LSA/ICL: 110/108; Valve Lash (Int/Exh): Hyd/Hyd; RPM Range: 1800/5200

The Lunati Tech said this cam would be a good cam too 20110549  - Street/Strip Retro-Fit Hydraulic Roller Cam - Chevrolet Big Block 290/300 - Retro-Fit Hydraulic Roller Cam. Excellent mid range torque and HP. Needs 2000 RPM stall converter, headers, 9.5:1 compression ratio and 3.73 gearing. Fair idle.; Advertised Duration (Int/Exh): 290/300; Duration @ .050 (Int/Exh): 232/242; Gross Valve Lift (Int/Exh): .578/.595; LSA/ICL: 112/110; Valve Lash (Int/Exh): Hyd/Hyd; RPM Range: 2000-6000 - I wouldn't think this cam would need anything for vacuum since it has a 112 LSA, but the tech thought a vacuum can would be needed for power brakes.

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1 hour ago, 72 Monte Carlo said:

Tim,

Have you had a chance to drive your car with the new roller cam in it? If so, how is the vacuum for your power brakes?

 


I have only had it on the run stand, my car is at the body shop currently.   I’ve been trying to get the Qjet to idle properly.  My vacuum was initially 10-12hg at idle.  After some adjustments I’ve gotten it up to 13-15hg at idle, but I’ve gained an idle surge.  I’ve been getting help via email from Cliff’s performance on the carb.  But Cliff doesn’t care for my 110 LSA on my cam and wants me to swap it.  After the first flat tappet cam failing and redoing the entire engine twice, I have no plans to take it out.  I’ve had larger cams on the street than this with Holley’s and none of these idle issues.  I was hoping to keep the Qjet for originality, but it’s not looking promising.    
 

I know your feelings on not spending the extra on a roller setup, I felt exactly the same. Unfortunately it bit me in [censored] in the end. 

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13 minutes ago, 72 Monte Carlo said:

Do you think if you went with the 20110549 roller cam with the 112 LSA, that you might have been happier with it?

No, I think I would’ve went with the 20110547,   .534/.544 218/226 @ .050” and 112 LSA.    

The 20110549 has more lift than I wanted.  I was trying to stay in the .520-.540” area. 

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My friend said I should consider the LS6 450 HP solid lifter camshaft, but I think it's on 450 horse in the 454 engine, and like 375 HP in the 396/402.

Anyone else running an aftermarket solid lifter flat tappet cam, and if so, how do you like it compared to a hydraulic lifter flat tappet cam?

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I'm running a solid flat tappet cam in my 496. What are your plans for your car? 

The valve train is noisy compared to a hydraulic lifter. Your supposed to check valve lash, none with hydraulic. 

Now a days you can get a variety of hydraulic cams with better profiles to out perform the old LS6 solid cam. Not that it was a bad cam in its day. 

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I plan on driving the car and have fun with it. I want to make sure that it will blow the doors of my friend's 79 Z28 with his 383 stroker engine. 

I was looking at Lunati's # 10110702 and # 10110703 hyd flat tappet cams, and also Tim's hyd roller cam 20110548 and also at # 20110547 and # 20110549.

I noticed that Lunati has a flat tappet solid lifter cam # 30110501 Solid Flat Tappet. Good replacement for LS6 motors with very strong mid range and top end torque and HP. Needs 2200-2500 RPM stall converter, headers, 9:1 compression and 3.55 gearing. Good idle.; Advertised Duration (Int/Exh): 272/272; Duration @ .050 (Int/Exh): 238/238; Gross Valve Lift (Int/Exh): .550/.550; LSA/ICL: 110/106; Valve Lash (Int/Exh): .020/.022; RPM Range: 2200-6500

 

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A roller will make more power than a solid flat tappet cam. Also, with a roller you can use any oil with a hydraulic or solid flat tappet you should use an oil with a high zinc content. An added expense every time you change the oil. 

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Who here is running the Lunati 10110702 262 cam in their big block? Do you like it or do you wish you would've went with the 10110703 268 cam?

I just don't think I can swing a roller cam right now, especially since I need to buy a stall converter for the trans, and I'm just going to install new main and rod bearings, new piston rings and throw a hone to the cylinders. The cylinders and pistons look great, but since I have the motor torn down, I might as well freshen it up internally.

I'm going to buy some new Comp Cams roller tip rockers and 7/16" pushrods, GM Delphi hydraulic lifters, valve springs, keepers, etc to match the camshaft. 

If the damn roller cam lifters weren't so frickin' expensive for a set of Howards (Morel) lifters, because I don't know if I want to trust the Lunati lifters,  I'd go the roller cam way. The cam and lifters would be around $660 and then I still have to buy the rockers and pushrods ($202), valve springs retainers, and locks ($?). I still have to buy the main and rod bearings ($100), and the piston rings ($60 or so).

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I'm ready to buy a cam, but would like to hear from people that has installed the 60202 (10110702 262*) cam and if they are happy with it, or if they wished they had installed the 268* Lunati cam. I'd like to hear from the ones that have installed the 60203 (10110703 268*) cam, to find out how the street manners are of that cam and if they installed a stall converter since it's recommended to run a 2500 rpm stall converter. 

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My Hooker Competition ceramic coated headers have 3.5" collectors and the outside diameter of the primaries is 2", so I assume that the internal diameter of the primaries are 1 7/8". I want to make sure that I can use them with the cam I end up buying.

Thanks!

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On 10/23/2020 at 4:23 PM, 72 Monte Carlo said:

 

If the damn roller cam lifters weren't so frickin' expensive for a set of Howards (Morel) lifters, because I don't know if I want to trust the Lunati lifters,  I'd go the roller cam way. 

I was told Morel makes Howard’s & Lunati’s, and a few others supposedly.     Comp Cams rollers are the only ones I’ve been told to definitely stay away from.  But, like anything else, it’s a mechanical part and things can fail.  I do know oil choice is extremely important with hydraulic roller lifters. From my research 10w-40 Driven HR-5 oil by Joe Gibbs is a top choice.  

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