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Locked Trunk, no key


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45 minutes ago, cny first gen 71 said:

That's usually the only day of the winter at least until march or April depending on if our winter ever ends. Last year we still had snow in may. Last year was a light winter for us just a little under 100 inches of snow for the season,  we usually average about 125 or so. It's been in the garage for about 2 months now.

Ya I get it I grew up in Minnesota so I fully understand. Now I live in Cincinnati and I wish for a decent amount of snow

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My key doesn't work in the trunk either and I don't remember if it ever did. I ordered the electric trunk opener and have been lucky, so far, that it always works. This fall after I backed it into the garage for the winter, I pushed the green button in the glove box to open the trunk and guess what!

I will let you all know this spring the outcome.................

Bruce

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On 12/30/2020 at 11:40 AM, azimpal said:

 

This did it!  There was a lot of junk back there, some of which was in the way, making this a 2-handed/2-broomstick kind of job.  Don't use too wide of a screwdriver...1/4" or so will fit.  Also, in this video, it looks like it's just a slot.  His is disassembled, so what you can't see is the rod to the back of the tumbler.  In the screenshot above, you can see what the actual piece is, and below is what it looks like assembled.  It's visible inside that slot and it jiggles. Other than that, the process was very straight-forward and exactly as this video described.  Thank you for this!

Also, I checked while I was down there.  My square key only fits the ignition, not the doors or the trunk, fwiw.  

1775758327_TrunkLatch(behind)2.thumb.jpg.cf024996faf785427c8b220c41e57b99.jpg

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On 1/2/2021 at 12:33 PM, jcakes said:

This did it!  There was a lot of junk back there, some of which was in the way, making this a 2-handed/2-broomstick kind of job.  Don't use too wide of a screwdriver...1/4" or so will fit.  Also, in this video, it looks like it's just a slot.  His is disassembled, so what you can't see is the rod to the back of the tumbler.  In the screenshot above, you can see what the actual piece is, and below is what it looks like assembled.  It's visible inside that slot and it jiggles. Other than that, the process was very straight-forward and exactly as this video described.  Thank you for this!

 

Glad it worked, but I think it only worked because your key is broke off in the lock cylinder, allowing it to turn from the back side. Reason I say that, is because I initially thought that would work, until I went out in the shop and tried to verify it. Many times, we've all opened the latch from the outside with a screwdriver when the lock cylinder is out, like when we're doing body work/painting and need to open/close the trunk for alignment. Only problem was when I tried it from the back side, it wouldn't turn without inserting the key in the cylinder. (I was working with about 2 hours sleep when I initially typed a reply to you a couple of days ago, but changed it to removing the latch bolts after verifying it didn't work)

If you notice in the video, it looks like the lock cylinder is already removed from the trunk lid when he uses the screwdriver. It also looks like that retainer spring was broken from the cylinder which maybe didn't keep that drive pin in place when turning the key, letting the latch work from the back. He verified it when he said the key just went in and flopped from side to side and nothing happened to unlock it.

Basically, I'm just putting this out there that it will not work for someone if their lock cylinder is fully intact, and you just lost your keys. Good news is, once you get that cylinder out, your locksmith may find a key in there when you bring it to him to match the doors. ( I also verified this in my '69 Z/28, it won't turn without the key inserted).

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Hmmm...I'll have to try and remember to update when I figure it out.  The lock cylinder isn't high on my priority list right now, so it may be awhile.  With the whole square vs round key question, I tried the square one in the trunk lock for S's and giggles, and I didn't feel anything stopping me other than it wasn't the correct key.  I don't remember it ever breaking off in there.  It was functional when I drove it and AKAIK, no one else broke one off in there, but we'll have to see.  It's been two decades after all...who knows! 

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At any rate, it shouldn't turn from the back if the whole thing is intact. I verified this with 2 older/that era cars in my shop and no way would they turn from the back, unless the key is inserted. If you noticed in the video, he showed where the link rod was all bent up and wasn't attached to the lock cylinder at all, plus he stated that his key flopped around, like it wasn't attached to the latch mechanism at all. Just thinking out loud...who knows I could be wrong.

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5 minutes ago, Dtret said:

I just tried mine for curiosity and would not work, latch locked, no keys. But it did work if key was installed in the lock. FYI. Joe is correct 

Thanks for verifying Dennis!

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On 1/2/2021 at 5:11 PM, jft69z said:

At any rate, it shouldn't turn from the back if the whole thing is intact. I verified this with 2 older/that era cars in my shop and no way would they turn from the back, unless the key is inserted. If you noticed in the video, he showed where the link rod was all bent up and wasn't attached to the lock cylinder at all, plus he stated that his key flopped around, like it wasn't attached to the latch mechanism at all. Just thinking out loud...who knows I could be wrong.

Curiosity got the best of me, so I removed the mechanism and tumbler.  After I got the (3) bolts for the latch mechanism itself out, I felt that bar/rod and tried to see where it would go and what it would do by gently moving it around.  In the process, the spring fell out but so did something else.  It's kind of hard to see, but it looks like the backside of the tumbler broke.

715194646_TrunkTumbler.thumb.jpg.8ece462643331b12500d36cf019e5f20.jpg 


Not sure when, but the break itself looks like clean metal, so I wonder if I did it?  I also tried the square key one more time to see if something was stuck in the tumbler, and it goes pretty far in.    

441790518_TrunkTumbler2.thumb.jpg.a203bdad211c71f1bcf1f72da73ddc27.jpg

So in the end, this wasn't a properly functioning lock to one degree or another, but I'm still unsure if there's a key stuck in there.  Perhaps this just widens the scope of 'when you can open the trunk from the backside' to include, the tumbler is broken in some way?

When I finally get around to replacing the tumbler and mechanism, I will definitely try this again.  Now I want to know for sure when it will and when it won't work and why.  

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1 hour ago, jcakes said:

  It's kind of hard to see, but it looks like the backside of the tumbler broke.

 
Not sure when, but the break itself looks like clean metal, so I wonder if I did it?  I also tried the square key one more time to see if something was stuck in the tumbler, and it goes pretty far in.    

.... but I'm still unsure if there's a key stuck in there.  Perhaps this just widens the scope of 'when you can open the trunk from the backside' to include, the tumbler is broken in some way?

 

The only reason I mentioned broken key was because you could turn it from the backside. All things being good, that shouldn't have happened. A busted up assembly like yours (or in the other guys video) would let you turn the latch from the back side as well. In the beginning we were going under the theory that everything with the lock cylinder assembly was intact/not broken, thus a broken key would be a likely (only) reason that allowed it to turn. Looks like there's no key from your pics, but like you said, maybe the assembly broke when you were trying to turn it, allowing it to unlock the trunk. 

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All this talk about trunk locks had me wondering about how the power trunk lock option worked. I remember some later chevys used to have a solenoid that bolted onto the existing latch, maybe 80's Impalas or something like that. But, after looking around, it appears the Monte uses a complete one piece assembly, solenoid/latch. The more I thought about it, the more I figured it would work good with the alarm/keyless entry system so I picked one up from YearOne. Soooo, thanks to this thread, I spent more money, hahaha. I just found a GM trunk lock switch in one of the boxes of parts out in the shop. Not sure if I'll wire that in, or just use the keyless, but I knew I had one somewhere...

20210109_130556.jpg

20210109_133601.jpg

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Good find! My 71 has a green switch in the glove box on the right side.

Bruce

 

Pwrtrunk2.jpg

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23 minutes ago, stangeba said:

Good find! My 71 has a green switch in the glove box on the right side.

Bruce

 

Thanks Bruce!

 When I was researching the power trunk lock deal, I did see there were two different colored buttons. I'm pretty sure the yellow button I grabbed from a later model Caprice that I stripped all the wiring harness stuff from when I was in the USAF.  I think it was totaled and I wanted the power locks, window motors, light sockets, newer fuse block type, etc. I've actually had that harness since the 80's, and still pick parts off of it now & then. Also think it was when I was stationed in Italy, possibly in a scrap yard on the airbase where servicemen's totaled cars ended up, not sure. Grabbed some early 80's Firebird 'PMD' bucket seats that I put in my prior '72 Custom when I got back stateside too. 

I looked last week, couldn't find the switch, or the power latch either. Still can't find the latch, but may have used it somewhere else over the years. Looks like those buttons are pricey now, no matter what color you have.

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6 hours ago, Traveler said:

I have 3 keys, 2 square 1 round, one of the square has notches cut in it and only works the drivers door, 2nd square ignition, round everything else, I think it is stock?

Doubtful. No car would have left the factory with that combination of keys. Which key opens the passenger door?

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I hadn't check this thread in awhile an now were talking about release buttons, one of the many reasons I luv this forum! FWIW I have the green button in my glove box like Bruce pictured. Theres always something to learn around here 

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I can't remember the last time I locked my doors! I never bring the round key because I thought that was just for the trunk, not the doors and I have an electric trunk opener. I better go check! I know the last time I tried, the trunk key would't open the trunk. My memory is telling me it NEVER worked....

 

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On a 1970 Monte the round key opens the trunk and locks and unlocks the glove box and the square key works in the door locks and ignition.  Another one of those things that make the 70 special.

rob

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5 hours ago, jft69z said:

Doubtful. No car would have left the factory with that combination of keys. Which key opens the passenger door?

round opens trunk passenger door and glove box, Rob Peters says square = doors so maybe some changes ignition lock or....

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On my 71 (Canada built) Monte the round key should open the trunk and locks and unlocks the glove box and the square key works in the door locks and ignition. Boy, I hope I can open my trunk this spring! I think I will go put the battery charger on right now!

 

 

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