680HPStroker Posted August 17, 2006 Share Posted August 17, 2006 This is basically for Don, but I'm curious what's required and is it possible to make power with a hydraulic roller cam past 6000rpm's on a big block and be safe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 17, 2006 Share Posted August 17, 2006 I HV THE HYD ROLLER AND put the beehive springs on it with lightweight rockers etc.. i was told shouldnt have too much trouble up to bout 6500 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heckeng Posted August 17, 2006 Share Posted August 17, 2006 I have had decent luck to around 6200-6400, but I think that's about the limit. The Lifters are so heavy, that you need pretty strong springs to hold them down, and if your springs are too heavy, then you can collapse your lifters. Comp says they don't recommend any HRs for over 6k for that reason too. Solid Roller is what you'd probably want if you're going to spin 'er up higher than 6k Just my opinion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
680HPStroker Posted August 17, 2006 Author Share Posted August 17, 2006 Solid roller is definitely out as I like enjoying my ride, not working on it all the time. According to the guys at Crane that if you have the right lifters(of course they say theirs), a push rod with a heavy wall, and 150#/1.90" springs that 7000rpms is definitely within range depending on cam profile. My dyno shop agrees that at around 6200rpms a hyd roller cam is all done. Thats ok as long as the power is there. My 489 is going back on the dyno tomarrow with my new cam and single plane intake. If it makes at least 500hp at the wheels at 6000rpms I'll be happy. The numbers say I should there and if I understood Don correctly he believes 500 at the wheels is within my grasp. That will be awesome for a production block running pump gas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 17, 2006 Share Posted August 17, 2006 Solid roller is definitely out as I like enjoying my ride, not working on it all the time. According to the guys at Crane that if you have the right lifters(of course they say theirs), a push rod with a heavy wall, and 150#/1.90" springs that 7000rpms is definitely within range depending on cam profile. My dyno shop agrees that at around 6200rpms a hyd roller cam is all done. Thats ok as long as the power is there. My 489 is going back on the dyno tomarrow with my new cam and single plane intake. If it makes at least 500hp at the wheels at 6000rpms I'll be happy. The numbers say I should there and if I understood Don correctly he believes 500 at the wheels is within my grasp. That will be awesome for a production block running pump gas. what block?? 2 bolt/4- year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam (Bones) Posted August 17, 2006 Share Posted August 17, 2006 a dyno-jet or a mustang dyno you get very different readings, depending on which chassis dyno you use, mine only made about 370 on a mustang, running 11.6's on the engine before that I had 378 with a dyno-jet, running 12.50's what horsepower, do you think I have? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 17, 2006 Share Posted August 17, 2006 All hyd lifters due to the nature of their design are limited in rpm, 62/6400 is the tops for any juice lifter wether it's flat or roller style. I've said it many times before hyd rollers are not racing cams! They are not a free lunch to race engine performance with zero up keep. The ramp profiles are between a flat tappet cam and a solid roller. If you were to take two cams of equal .050 duration and lift, one solid and one hyd roller the solid will make more peak power have a better power band hands down. Sorry for the rant! I dislike the cam guys that give the impression that the hyd roller is the best of both worlds. It's just an overweight hyd lifter with less friction and all the same draw backs for a TON more money!!!! Don Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
680HPStroker Posted August 18, 2006 Author Share Posted August 18, 2006 It will be pulled on a dyno-Jet and the block is a brand new GM MKVI, 4-bolt main, 454 block, stroked to a 489. Don I knew that would get a rise out of you if you were tuning in. I agree with you. I have to remember all these companies are in business to make money and they will tell you everything you want to hear, but in the end only experience tells the story. Today is the day. Wish me luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
680HPStroker Posted August 18, 2006 Author Share Posted August 18, 2006 Sorrt to chim in so many times, but Don if you are willing to send it to me I'd like the data for the set of bolt on bars you told me about before. I e-mailed you a couple times about it, but maybe it didn't get through. Thanks. Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 18, 2006 Share Posted August 18, 2006 It will be pulled on a dyno-Jet and the block is a brand new GM MKVI, 4-bolt main, 454 block, stroked to a 489. Don I knew that would get a rise out of you if you were tuning in. I agree with you. I have to remember all these companies are in business to make money and they will tell you everything you want to hear, but in the end only experience tells the story. Today is the day. Wish me luck! let us know what it makes and the specs on the heads/cam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
680HPStroker Posted August 18, 2006 Author Share Posted August 18, 2006 I'll post the results, but the heads are AFR 315 CNC and the cam is a 246/251, 651/651 with a 110 lobe separation made by Comp Cams. My carb is an AED 850 mechanical secondaries, intake is a ported Holley Strip Dominator, pistions are custom forged Weisco's at 10:1, crank is a standard Scat 4340, rockers are Harland Sharp 1.7 rollers, and my rods are Scat 4340 H-beam with ARP L-19 bolts. She ought to hold up pretty good for a long time unless I thrash it every weekend. I only intend on doing that a few times a year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 18, 2006 Share Posted August 18, 2006 sounds like a stout combo there!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 18, 2006 Share Posted August 18, 2006 600HP you have mail! Don Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam (Bones) Posted August 19, 2006 Share Posted August 19, 2006 Hey 600, how did you do on the dyno? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
680HPStroker Posted August 22, 2006 Author Share Posted August 22, 2006 I went to pick up my car on Monday with my trailer only to discover that my Monte broke the dyno! Just kidding. It was malfunctioning. The darn thing wouldn't even register until 5200rpms so the 468/446 pull I saw is not a true representation of the actual power I'm making at the wheels. The guy who owns the dyno shop says that due to the graph starting to plot so late in the run that there is a noticable amount of power not registering. He said it could be as high as 30hp, but until the machine is fixed we can't prove the power. Ed the shop owner did say that he believes that 480hp is definitely in there. Ed also stated that my motor at 451hp with the old cam was pretty respectable, but now it feels and sounds like "one nasty b*#ch". I sure hope he gets the dyno fixed and finishes tuning the car today. If not I'm going to pick up the car, take it home, get her all pretty again, and take it back when the dyno is fixed to finish up. On the way home I'll stop by my tranny shop and have shift points checked and make any needed changes. When I heard my Monte on the dyno it not only sounds really mean, but spins up faster than I expected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 22, 2006 Share Posted August 22, 2006 Hate to say it but "I told you it would like it!" Don Oh yeah I forgot something! You say it spun up faster than you expected? As in pulled rpms more quickly under load on the chassis dyno than it did before? If so then I have to ask, How do you like the RPM air gap now?LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
680HPStroker Posted August 22, 2006 Author Share Posted August 22, 2006 Yep Don it seems as if you were right. Now I got a guy who stopped by the shop and wants to sell a complete 72 mote minus the engine. He said that if he couldn't find a buyer by October he was going to put it in a demolision derby. He wants $350.00 for it. From the front of the doors forward is pretty rough and it has rust in the usual places below the back window. He states that the doors are solid, the quarters are decent, and the interior is in good shape. The tubo 350 slips a little, but it has a 12-bolt posi in it. If I can figure out a place to store it I'd kinda would like to pick it up to restore, prevent from being crushed, strip it for parts, or turn it into an all out drag car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 22, 2006 Share Posted August 22, 2006 600, If he is correct about the readings being off by as much as 30hp that would be 498 at the rear wheels. Thats dang close to 500hp. I can't remember if that was a cam profile you had or if it's one I had? Either way we need a vidoe clip with sound for the guy's here to checkout! Don I vote for full on drag!! With something really nasty under the hood!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
680HPStroker Posted August 23, 2006 Author Share Posted August 23, 2006 I'm taking my car home today. The dyno is down hard and the shop is waiting for a tech rep to come fix it. Don, I think I agree with you that a full on drag assult would be the ticket. I'm thinking something in that 540+ CID range and 800hp on either racing fuel, or alcohol. I'd have to get her down under 3000lbs to be worth the effort. It will take a lot of money to do it right. If I do this I'm looking at around a five year project. I can't wait to go cruising this weekend and mess with the rice burners and wanna be hot rodders again. You know the type, F-bodies, Mustangs, stock small/big block guys with a loud exhaust, turbo/supercharged 4/6 cylinder tuners. These are the guys who are always reving their cars and walking around puffing their chest out trying to show everyone up. True power guys are usually quiet and just sit back and chukkle at them and wait for real power to show up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
680HPStroker Posted August 24, 2006 Author Share Posted August 24, 2006 Well I took my car home last night and it looks like the best my combo will do right now is 475hp at the wheels. thats about 595hp at the flexplate. That will work for me(for now). Will possibly try to squeeze just a little more over the winter. Now it's roll cage, harness, and seat time. It's also tuner hunting season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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