abe72 Posted June 11, 2014 Share Posted June 11, 2014 Hello, I was driving down the road last night (going home) when suddenly the engine stalled and completely stopped. I was able to pull to the side away from traffic. I tried to start it, but no luck. Continued, and finally got it to crank but it wouldn't stay on, it did this a few times after cranking it for a while. Had to be towed home. Any ideas or thoughts? Thanks, Abe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daryl Posted June 11, 2014 Share Posted June 11, 2014 Is it a HEI type distubutor? If you got gas at the carb and a HEI my money is on the ignition module. Advance Auto and some of the other parts places have a machine to check them. I've seen several modules go out just like you decsribed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
502ci Posted June 11, 2014 Share Posted June 11, 2014 When you say it wouldn't stay on...did it run for a couple seconds or just keep cranking? If it just kept cranking and it was spinning quickly it would be that the timing chain jumped. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stangeba Posted June 11, 2014 Share Posted June 11, 2014 Remove the dist cap and crank the engine to verify it is turning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abe72 Posted June 11, 2014 Author Share Posted June 11, 2014 It has a hei Accel conversion kit about two years old. When cranking it did sound odd, spinning kinda fast then it would slow down and catch. Would fire up for 1-2 only. Also had a what I would describe like a chain sound or something. How or why would the chain jump, wasn't going very fast only about 35- 40 mph. Is this a quick fix? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leghome Posted June 11, 2014 Share Posted June 11, 2014 If it has the original or similar timing gears they are plastic and get brittle over time with the heat of the engine. I have had to replace a couple of timing gears over the years because of this. The chain sound could be the timing chain hitting the metal below the plastic. The only way to fix this is to take the front of the engine apart, water pump, harmonic balancer and timing chain cover. Not that hard of a job but time consuming. The hardest part for me was to make sure the timing marks were aligned properly. It can be off 180 degrees because the cam gear turns twice to the crank gear I think I have that right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abe72 Posted June 11, 2014 Author Share Posted June 11, 2014 My gut feeling tells me its the timing chain argh...gonna take a better look at it when time permits. Thanks guys for your suggestions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Sheean Posted June 12, 2014 Share Posted June 12, 2014 Sorry to hear that Abe. When my Monte did that I was just out of gas. Those old fuel gauges. Good luck with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abe72 Posted June 12, 2014 Author Share Posted June 12, 2014 Patrick, don't think it ran out of gas. Had just pumped a few gallons in prior to driving. Plus you can smell it while trying to start it. I could only wish it was out of gas... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
70 Iron Posted June 13, 2014 Share Posted June 13, 2014 My nylon cam gear broke and did the same as yours,it was running great and suddenly shut off,I also had the smell of gas.This was on a 350/300 hp. Fixed the chain/gear ect changed the oil and later dropped the pan to clean up the broken nylon gear and also this was in the screen and had to be scraped out,(thats a table spoon)no oil change would get it all out. This is from the screen only,the pan had as much Good luck with yours. Terry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rock Posted June 13, 2014 Share Posted June 13, 2014 Same thing happened to the car I owned when I was a kid....I just changed the gears and chain and retimed it without cleaning out the oil pan and low and behold I had low oil pressure which eventaully ruined the motor. I would definetly drop the oil pan. Just my .02 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abe72 Posted June 13, 2014 Author Share Posted June 13, 2014 Same thing happened to the car I owned when I was a kid....I just changed the gears and chain and retimed it without cleaning out the oil pan and low and behold I had low oil pressure which eventaully ruined the motor. I would definetly drop the oil pan. Just my .02 Rock and Terry, Thank you for your input and suggestions. I would have not of thought of it, but will make sure to drop the oil pan and clean it out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abe72 Posted June 21, 2014 Author Share Posted June 21, 2014 Quick update, took Monte into the shop and had it inspected and here is what I was told: After checking for fuel,spark (none)he determined that the cam shaft had broken in two. His reasoning was because half the motor was turning and not the back half where the distributor sits. Can this be possible? Said was extremely rare but does happen. I have two options. 1. replace the cam and timing gears, chain etc. 2. have the engine rebuilt completely. said the compression and other components were strong. The difference between the two options is about $1,000. Opinions - thoughts ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike 57 Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 I would have to see that. I find it hard to believe that there was enough load to break a cam without something really catastrophic happening in the engine. It would be a first for me and I have been around a lot of engines. I would like to see the engine turned over with a valve cover off and see only half of the valves moving. I would agree with timing gears, all the valves would not be moving. If the cam did actually break it would be nice to know the reason. And I would have the cam bearings replaced. So I guess the rebuild would be in order. Kind of hard to get at the cam bearings with the crank in place. Before I did anything I would insure that the cam is actually broken. Is this a trusted mechanic that you have used for years? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallaby Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 Ok, I've never seen a camshaft break in two. I HAVE seen a distributor gear shear the drive pin that holds it in place... the result is the drive gear rotates, but not the distributor shaft. This was a tricky diagnosis; visually the pin looked intact, and the gear was so tight on the shaft it couldn't be turned by hand. Amazing that the dist shaft put up enough resistance to shear that pin, but the distributor shaft also drives the oil pump and debris caught in the pump gears could cause that drive pin to snap. Verify that the oil pump rotates freely. Really, your guy needs to verify that the valve timing is correct to determine if the timing chain isn't the problem. I've also seen timing chains jump teeth on the sprockets, but still move the valves. Obviously, the engine won't run that way even though it LOOKS like everything is moving as it should. It's much more common to have a problem between the top of the engine and the bottom (timing chain), than to have a problem between the front & back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rock Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 If it was me I would pull the motor and go through it completely. I am sure this is not a daily driver so do it on your own schedule. Those old 350 are real easy to work on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam (Bones) Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 I have seen a broken cam , it was on a medium duty truck with a 427 tall deck I would pull the engine and do a complete overhaul, with the car being 42 years old, if the engine has never been opened up before, that timing set is on borrowed time anyway Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stangeba Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 Very interesting problem, I can't wait to see pictures. Just thinking out loud here but, If the camshaft broke, the ft part would still spin, the rear part would not spin, neither would the distributor and I believe at least 2 of the cylinders would have valves in the open position making proper compression hard to believe unless the cam broke just in front of the dist gear. Bruce Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
footballubet Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 Can't understand why he thinks the cam broke. I would want to see the engine turned over by hand with the valve covers and dist. cap removed to see what all is moving. If the dist isn't turning he should pull it out to check the gear. Then look down the the hole for the dist and see if the cam is turning. I've only seen 1 camshaft broke but it wasn't the only thing in the engine that gernaded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abe72 Posted June 25, 2014 Author Share Posted June 25, 2014 Well, I have opted to have the engine rebuilt. Estimated time to complete is about two weeks, but no hurry on my part. I've asked my mechanic to take pictures of the process (definitely of the cam) he agreed. He is a trusted mechanic, has done our family cars over the years. As the pictures come in I'll share them here. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Sheean Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 Good call on the rebuild Abe. Definitely the right call. It will be interesting to see what's going on too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abe72 Posted July 4, 2014 Author Share Posted July 4, 2014 The rebuild is coming along and should be ready early this week. Pictures will be forthcoming. I saw the cam and it was in two pieces. Question - How/what is the best way to break in the engine, what should I look for? Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbreese Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 Sounds like you are well on the way to having the Monte back on the road! What type of cam will you have? Hydraulic Flat Tappet or Hydraulic Roller. This will dictate what break in procedure for the cam is needed. Once you get the cam broken in and change the oil, go out and have fun and mash the loud pedal. David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abe72 Posted July 7, 2014 Author Share Posted July 7, 2014 Sounds like you are well on the way to having the Monte back on the road! What type of cam will you have? Hydraulic Flat Tappet or Hydraulic Roller. This will dictate what break in procedure for the cam is needed. Once you get the cam broken in and change the oil, go out and have fun and mash the loud pedal. David Not sure which one, but I'm guessing roller type (is that the norn?)nothing fancy or high end I know, basic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
footballubet Posted July 7, 2014 Share Posted July 7, 2014 Flat tappet is the norm. You need to find out for sure for break-in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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