carb/engine or vacumn issue

[wallaby]

It's not going to hurt to put in some fresh fuel either.

[jvssmail]

I had a few minutes at work and just read through these replys quickly so if I repeat what someone already said please excuse me . Have you checked the fuel lines for kinks you may possibly have kinked it when you did the brake repair. try running a temp brake line to see how it runs.

[montefrazer]

Thanks for the reply. Yes. It is the original distributor still..even the spark plugs are original I believe. Ac remy plugs with the green spiral pattern. I got this car from a 70 yr old lady. Alot of maitenance records but none involving items above. Since 1984 only 10 k miles were put on it and it has 62k orig miles. It sat a lot so I'm sure I have alot of work to do. I'm just north of milwaukee border in menomonee falls. If it ran properly I could probably even meet you somewhere. Today I had to baby the throttle with my foot to get it to warm up without stalling but I didn't take it out. I did some idle mixture screw adjustments during this process and seemed it was the only way to keep it from stalling. I'm curious on where that ground wire goes in my pic. Even after I shut it down to restart it the crank sounded much different then normal..quiter crank but almost like it was laboring but still started everytime. No black smoke, no smoke at all. Just a very rich smelling fuel that burn the eyes once idling rough. Thanks for your help. If your not to far I could definately arrange a meet or something if I get it runinng good enough.

 

Take care eric

 

You're up in Ernie country. "Who do you know wants to buy a car?" I'm on the North end of Racine close to the power plant. I get to Milwaukee a lot to visit friends and relatives. Still willing to come look if you want. Any time Saturday or Sunday works for me.

[72jrfan88]

I had a few minutes at work and just read through these replys quickly so if I repeat what someone already said please excuse me . Have you checked the fuel lines for kinks you may possibly have kinked it when you did the brake repair. try running a temp brake line to see how it runs.

 

I crawled under the car and follwed the line to the pump. I don't see any kinks. I pulled the line off the pump and fuel is coming out pretty steady but not real fast. From what I understand this fuel line is gravity run..so as long as the pump has fuel it should be getting enough correct? The pump seems to be good. I did check my distributor and some of the points seem to be on real tight and others you need no force to pull them off..almost if they are just resting on the cap..is this normal or could these wires be my culprit

[badddoin]

always start with the easiest, check your filter

 

 

And the cheapest!

 

I'd also, if it were me, start with things that wouldn't be a bad thing to get done anyway - a complete tune-up:

 

New plugs

New wires

New cap and rotor

New points

New condenser

New fuel filter

New air filter

 

While the plugs are out, do a compression test - just in case.

If the problem persisted after that, then I'd look to rebuid (or have rebuilt) the carb. My SWAG (scientific wild [censored] guess) is that your needle isn't seating enough to idle properly.

 

Good luck!

[montefrazer]

Wires should be tight in the cap and be a nice clean aluminum or copper color depending on type of ends your wires have. Would be a very noticeable miss if one or more plugs isn't firing.

[72jrfan88]

From what I can tell the wires appear to be ok. My issue is about 4 of the 8 wires that go to the distributor seem loose. When I plug them into the distributor it seems like I should be able to hear snap on to the points. They seem to just rest on the top cover where the others seem real tight. The aluminum seems clean but it doesn't seem to fix to anything under the cover almost as if the gaps are to wide and not fixing where as the plug wire covers going in the block snap in real nice. I also see a worn green wire from a connector going near drivers side heads. Its a little plug connector and one of the wires is broke. Does anyone know what this controls? Also near voltage regulator I see a ground wire that is not connected. Here are some recent pics. Any help identifying this would be great.

 

 

http://s754.photobucket.com/albums/xx188/microwave3

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[montefrazer]

That broken green wire is for the temperature sender for your dash gauge or light. Don't recognize the other wire but I'm sure someone will.

[Sam (Bones)]

sharp monte!

 

that sender/plug is for the TSC (trans spark control)

that system has usually been disabled by now

just hook that ground to a bolt, it should be a light ground for your headlights/turn/parking lights

[72jrfan88]

Ok thank you guys for the replies! So that isn't a oil temp connector? Just curious because all my gauges function but I have no red lights so to speak. My manual says that when u turn the key the gen. Oil should flash red to show its working. So I guess I cant tell if I'm running hot. I was thinking the bulbs could just be burned out? I'm beginning to think my rough engine maybe caused from a stuck choke possibly. Today I noticed that the choke was stuck in the closed position when the engine was cold. Usually I have to tap the gas and then it closes.I didn't notice this earlier when you guys asked about it but just saw today.would a stuck choke cause this issue?

[wallaby]

Well, it could be normal.

When you go to start the car, you need to tap the gas to set the choke and at the same time it squirts some fuel into the engine. When you twist the key it should be ready to go. When the choke closes it engages a fast idle setting, so when it does start it runs fast to keep it going. wait several seconds and tap the gas again and the idle should slow down some.

 

Once the engine has started, it should pull the choke plate open a bit right away, and then the choke plate will gradually open as the engine warms up. It should be straight up & down when the engine is warmed up.

[72jrfan88]

Yes. That it usually how it was running.good fast idle. Tap gas and idle comes down.But as of recent I can't even obtain a fast idle. Something is off. When I start car it idles slow like it has been warmed up already. Then when i give it gas it sometimes sputters and misses to the point i think it would die if i drove it.I am going to check timing and plugs/distributor this week. Engine seems to be getting good fuel.I will keep updates along the way. Thanks again for all the help

[montefrazer]

"So that isn't a oil temp connector?"

 

There is no oil temp connector. Oil pressure sender and connector is next to the distributor on a small block.

[72jrfan88]

Hello. Today I changed out plugs and inspected distributor and what I noticed was that the vacumn advance connected to distrubutor seems to not be working. Using a vacumn gauge it took 12 psi to finally move the plate in distributor. I still have no fast idle and using a meter I constantly run at 700 rpm. Step on gas and it still skips. Motor is getting fuel as I can idle 15 mins with no problems.When I disconnect vacum line going to distributor as well as the ports to the carb I get no change in idle at all and it seems to have no vacumn at all going through the line. I'm wondering if anyone of you are familiar with vacumn advance and if my car is displaying symptoms of it being bad. It doesnt seem I have any air pressure even close to 12 lbs in my line. Thx in advance for any input

[stangeba]

The vacuum advance hose is hooked up to "ported" vacuum on my 71 350 Qudrajet. Ported will have ZERO vacuum (rated in inches of Mercury) at idle but will go up as the throttle is opened. Originally there were switches that would only allow vacuum when the automatic transmission shifted into 3rd gear or Reverse for testing and on a 4 speed, 4th gear. I assume your "emissions controls" were removed or by-passed like mine. With engine off, look down the carb and find the accelerator pump discharge nozzles. SLOWLY open the throttle, (engine off) and look for a steady strong squirt from the TWO discharge nozzles located in the front of the front two primary venturis. I'm thinking they are dirty or plugged.

Good luck,

Bruce

[72jrfan88]

Ok thanks for the information. I will be tinkering a bit today. I will see what I can find. If ventris are plugged is a full disasembly required to dislodge debris required? I was also thinking I could have a bad accelerator pump. I know my carb is way out of adjustment as I was turning all the screws a bit thinking that was the issue initially. Once I have a good base to start with I should be able to get the csrb adjusted right..as of now I get no response when adjusting any of the screws

[stangeba]

On my 71 the two idle mixture screws did little to change my idle quality other than it wouldn't idle when turned in all the way. There is also an idle screw and a high speed idle screw. I bet your discharge accelerator pump squirters are plugged or the pump is wore out. Look at the stream first. I would not just run out and get a rebuilt carb, I do not like auto parts rebuilt carbs plus they require a "core" or core charge and once you give them your old carb, it's GONE! If anything, have yours rebuilt. Sometimes the primary throttle shaft or shaft holes are worn causing a vacuum leak and ever changing "return to" idle speed.

[72jrfan88]

Good news! It ended up being a combination of bad original plugs and bad distributor points (they were almost melted) and I got a new cap and rotor right away. Not to mention Im embarrased to say I was 6 turns out on drivers side idle mix and 4 out on pass side) once these issues were corrected she fired right up and went into fast idle. The car runs amazing now. Took it on a 30 mile cruise. Ever since I owned it it always had a slight bog if I mash the gas like at a red light...but then it catches and runs like the wind. If I gradually punch it it won't do this. I heard this is common on a 4 brl quadrajet.I'm kind of new to this car so I was wondering if that's "normal"

[wallaby]

You can dial that hesitation out. It sounds as if your secondary spring is set too loose. It's a bit tricky, but described here: I suggest maybe 1/4-1/2 turn tighter on the adjustment screw. Here is the entire procedure, perhaps described a little more complicated than it has to be but gives a good understanding of the process:

 

Secondary airvalve adjustment is made using the spring windup adjustment screw and its lock screw located at the secondary airvalve lever. Procedure is as follows:

 

The secondary spring windup is adjusted with a small, slotted-head screw on the passenger side of the carb, right at the top of the carb on the secondary side. The screw head points right out to the side. 90 degrees from this, on the bottom, there is an allen-head lock screw that keeps the slotted screw from turning. If you have trouble seeing it, place a mirror under the area until you spot it. With a small slotted screwdriver holding the adjustment screw, loosen the allen screw about ¼ turn. This will allow you to turn the slotted adjustment screw. Counting the turns, allow the slotted screw to slowly unwind until all spring tension is gone. You can use your mirror to see the spring disengage contact from the pin lever underneath the air horn. If the spring tension was lost after only ½ turn, the windup was too loose. Bring the spring into contact with the lever. Note when it just barely touches. From this point, wind the spring up between ¾ turn and 7/8 turn. This is a good starting point, and will prevent any bogs or hesitations due to premature secondary opening. From here, you can loosen the windup about 1/8 to 1/4 turn at a time and test-drive the car - when the car falls on its face or feels "flat" going into the secondaries, you've hit the max point. Tighten the spring back up 1/8 to 1/4 turn, and you have the quickest secondary opening rate that your car/engine will handle.

 

 

[Sam (Bones)]

most quadrajets like the idle screws out 3-4 turns

[72jrfan88]

Wow..that's great advice. Very fortunate to have found this site. Thanks a lot to all. That will give me something else to tinker with now thanks to all of you

[stangeba]

Great news!

[montefrazer]

Did you check the accelerator pump as Bruce suggested? A bad one can cause hesitation off the line if it doesn't shoot extra gas into the carb when it's needed.

[72jrfan88]

I did check the pump. It squirts a decent amount a fuel as far as I know for a 42 year old carb. I'm thinking its probably a slight misadjusted secondary screw like mentioned above. The hesitation is intermitent. It can sometimes happen even if I am traveling about 10 mph as well and then step on it, so it doesn't always happen from a complete stop either. Other times it runs perfect. Needless to say I'm glad its running good again! It only needs a slight dwell adjustment but I wanted to log some miles first and it was real humid here yesterday so I want to adjust when its a little less humid

[Leghome]

"It can sometimes happen even if I am traveling about 10 mph as well and then step on it, so it doesn't always happen from a complete stop either. Other times it runs perfect. "

I had a 325 horse 327 in my 68 nova that had a q-jet and it did the asame thing. Ran like a scared rabbit most of the time but every once in a while when you punched it it fell flat on it's face. I never did figure out what caused it and neither did any of the mechanics I had look at it.