jays55 Posted February 6, 2011 Share Posted February 6, 2011 Have there been any verified cases of forged build sheets for the Monte SS454s; like are common with Corvettes and SS Chevelles? With fond memories of the '70 and '72 Montes I had back in "the day", I am hoping 2011 will be the year I purchase my Monte SS. Been following this forum for some time and really appreciate the knowledge being shared on these rare cars. Very serious about confirming that, when I find one, it's truly an SS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7tonemonte Posted February 6, 2011 Share Posted February 6, 2011 Welcome to the site, I havent heard of any cases of forged build sheets on a Monte,maybe because of all the SS specific things located under the car. Not like a Chevelle SS. Check them out here Also, generally speaking,an SS Chevelle is worth cloning financially, a Monte... well? Good luck on your search for one, stick around here, Im sure you can find something. There is one listed right now in the For Sale section Link to 71 SS Id say its worth taking a look at Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Gray SS Posted February 6, 2011 Share Posted February 6, 2011 I haven't heard of one either. There was a guy on ebay selling them though. You send the particulars and he would make it, aged and all. He could even put seat spring stains on them. Â Just gotta do a real good visual under the car and hope the traces are all there like Tony was saying. Â Where in Oregon are you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Posted February 6, 2011 Share Posted February 6, 2011 Welcome to the message board! Great group of people here. Â I have not heard of a faked SS build sheet yet either but that doesn't mean they aren't out there. Â There are a lot of great folks in the club from the Northwest. We just had our 2010 Western Meet in Oregon last August and our 2011 meet is in Boise, Idaho. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
overdrive Posted February 6, 2011 Share Posted February 6, 2011 Welcome, Jay. Â I haven't heard of any. An unrestored Monte SS is a safe bet in my eyes, or one that's been restored and has lots of pics before the restoration. Of course, it has to have all of the SS specific parts in place and showing their age and no signs of tampering. An affidavit from the original owner or at least a previous owner from the 70s would be good documentation. Who cloned Montes in the 70s? Monte SS454s aren't nearly as popular as Chevelles and Camaros, so there's little serious interest in cloning and misrepresenting one. I'm not saying there is no interest, only that there's little compared to other models. Â I've read here before about the guy that prints and ages build sheets. I've read other places about guys that restamp motors, so I don't think I can rely 100% on either of those methods of proof, especially for a Chevelle or other high dollar muscle car. It's becoming harder and harder to be confident about how a car started out from the factory. As far as fake build sheets go, how can I spot one as a fake when it's been aged? Is it the aging that tips someone off or is it something else? Â Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KWick_70MC Posted February 6, 2011 Share Posted February 6, 2011 Most fake build sheets for any car usually has 4 lines in the STATEMENT OF ACCEPTANCE BY CARRIER section in the lower right hand corner. The real deals have 5 lines. Â Kevin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tazman Posted February 6, 2011 Share Posted February 6, 2011 I have a 71 SS that I have been considering selling. I have 2 build sheets neither have been forged. My personal guarntee. PM sent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jays55 Posted February 6, 2011 Author Share Posted February 6, 2011 More great info....thanks guys! I have restored several Chevys ('55,'65,'68,'70) and always liked the pre-69 cars where the SS was a different model number. I agree that faking Monte SSs is probably not a high priority for crooks considering their value vs Chevelles & El Caminos. That's good for us! I'm in Bend and hope to make it to Boise (with a car would be nice!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
black07ss Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 Jay Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monte7071 Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 Never heard a fake sheet with a Monte but Chevelles Corvetts and Camaros yes just not big money in the Montes. I have seen some that people were told they had a SS and not true but that is a different story. Both SS cars I have owned had no build sheet but had all the SS items. Do your homework ask questions and try to inspect yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KWick_70MC Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 Do your homework ask questions and try to inspect yourself. Â Dito... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Mau Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 Welcome to the FGMCC, Jay! Â I haven't heard of any verified cases of forged SS454 build sheets, either, and quite frankly I hope that I never do. Â I personally feel that "cloning" a special edition car, building a "tribute", or recreating a window sticker with the car's options/list prices on it for the love of the vehicle, hobby, etc. is one thing, but I personally feel that faking a build sheet is going too far - regardless of what kind of vehicle it is. Either you have a real deal build sheet or you don't, and I consider the intent of such an action to be just as dishonest as re-stamping an engine block or tampering with a VIN. Â I agree with you - that prior to '69 it was great when the SS cars had a slightly different body series/style # as part of their VIN! Â Â Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monteman1971 Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 Welcome Jay.....As you can see...great group here. Â As most have said..not much financial gain to faking a Monte SS..but there are plenty of guys out there selling Monte's that really do think they have an SS...so be careful and do your homework. Â Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
black07ss Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 FYI the 72 SS were limited to zero Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 I only know of one case many years ago. Â A person aqcuired a SS Monte with a buildsheet which appeared to be have been altered to say it had a LS-6 engine in it... I seem to remember that once he checked the engine stamping, it was clear that this was not the case... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jays55 Posted February 8, 2011 Author Share Posted February 8, 2011 Good advice KWick 70MC and Monte7071. I would be hard pressed to buy a collector car without seeing it in person or have someone trustworthy check it out objectively for me. The only possible exception would be an unrestored car, which would be less likely to have hidden problems........ 2010 was a good buyer's year for SS Montes on ebay and hopefully 2011 will produce a few good examples to consider. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vaughn Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 Welcome to the site Jay, good luck with your hunt for a SS. Car or no car, it would be great to see you at the Western meet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dans '70 Z20 Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 WARNING! Â Don't rely fully on a so-called Antique & Classic Auto inspector if the car is out of the area. They are not always all their cracked up to be. I myself flew out to pick up a car I had inspected and was VERY surprised at what was over looked by a so-called inspector. I could have done a more thorough inspection. Shoddy bodywork, new rocker installed improperly, bottom back corner or rear w/o stuffed with bondo just to start ..... and the best was it was touted as a southern car but when looking at some ex-owner paperwork in console, glove box it was actually from Jersey!! I flew from NY to avoid buying a car from the Northeast. Needless to say, I flew back home and gave inspector a piece of my mind. Â Same happened to a friend of mine. After realizing owner of inspection agency knew his stuff but just actual inspector did a half assed job he agreed to pay for partial inspection but reviewed point -by -point what was missed. He was then offered a job to be a local inspector here should they ever have a need. LOL Â REMEMBER: Since from the same area these inspectors usually travel the same circles as the classic car dealers in the area and often have relationships with them. Who are they working for? Beware! Â Better off having a member of FGMCC take a first glance before you spend any money on moving forward with a possible sale. Â Good Luck. I am sure the bunch here will keep you informed of any that come up for sale. Â Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jays55 Posted February 8, 2011 Author Share Posted February 8, 2011 Thanks for the advice on "independent inspectors". Seen a lot of them advertised, but never used one. Been a member of Classic Chevy Int'l for 37yrs and have had good luck in the past asking members to look at cars in their local area. I have noticed that FGMCC guys will check out ebay cars and report on the forum. A great source of information..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Gray SS Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 Ditto what Dan said on the inspectors. I have used them twice and it was a complete waste of money. Use the money for a plane ticket or even play the lottery with it and you are better off. Â I had friends that used a different company and theirs was worse than mine. They told the inspector they were looking at a non-numbers matching Chevelle that had a BBC transplant with a conversion from auto to M-22. The report came back with a note: Â "If you don't buy this REAL DEAL LS-6 4 speed, I am!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 I have used an FGMCC member in Reno to inspect and test drive my 72 Monte before I bought it. I had met him and seen his car in person before so I knew how picky he was. I was pleased with the results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam (Bones) Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 if you are going to spend that kind of money, please!...go see it yourself Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jays55 Posted February 9, 2011 Author Share Posted February 9, 2011 I've been cruising the forum looking at photos of members build sheets. I notice that all of the options listed on the lower section are usually in alphabetical order. Is this pretty universal? That would be a red flag to a doctored up build sheet. Type style seems to be an indication of a fake. I know I'm probably being over paranoid, but this is a real problem with other rare cars (that doesn't seem to have migrated to the Montes) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Gray SS Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 My understanding is yes, alphabetical and font should be consistent with what you see on the ones posted here too I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cny first gen 71 Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 See if you can find someone that makes the fake ones and if there not to expensive have them make one for you and look at it compared to the real deal see if there close. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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